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How to spot a true animal lover

January 11, 2012 Editor


Anyone can say that they love animals, but do they really? I’ve met several people who say they love dogs, but when they came face to face with my Irish Setter they cowered in a corner in fear. For those who don’t know, Irish Setters are not vicious. They’re actually large bundles of love. In fact, I don’t believe that any dog is innately vicious. When you meet a nasty dog, look at the owner or previous owners because, more often than not, people are to blame for mean dogs.

I’ve also met people who say they love animals, but “not in the house where they might dirty up the place.” While I will concede to the fact that I personally don’t want to live in the same house as a chicken, a pig, a cow, or a horse, I couldn’t imagine living inside my home while part of my family is forced to live outside at the mercy of the elements. Radar (my dog), George, Violet, and Salem (my cats) are family.

Before I made the decision to ‘adopt’ a dog into my family, I did a lot of reading, a lot of thinking, and a lot of soul-searching. There were articles that came right out and said ‘don’t get a dog if… you don’t like hair, fur, or muddy footprints in your house.’ At the time, I had much younger children and, so, I had already committed to living with happy fun-loving little mess makers. Getting a dog wasn’t really going to stretch me at all… a little more vacuuming, a little more mopping, no big deal. True animal lovers accept the ‘bad’ with the ‘good.’

Cats. They’re different from dogs. Cats are very majestic and bossy. Dogs are easy-going, loving, and, most often, complacent. What do they have in common?  Both are loyal and loving. Each cat, however; will choose its own way of sharing affection and you pretty much have to go with it. You are not the ‘boss’ of the cat. The basic hierarchy in a home with both of these animals is… cat, human, dog.

A true animal lover loves all animals even if they don’t want to live with all of them. I can feel sympathy for the plight of a porcupine, but I don’t want to live with it.

A true animal lover would NEVER harm an animal or abandon it to the elements. All animals have feelings whether people care to admit to it or not.

The sign of a true animal lover? Someone who is almost always covered in fur, has ‘poop’ bags in their pockets, and has ‘pet’ pictures displayed right along with ‘family’ pictures.


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Perspectives by Rev. Sue McCullough

January 11, 2012 Editor


Today I’m writing this as I sit at the table of a retreat house in Memphis, TN where the weather is a balmy 20 degrees Celsius. The sun has been shining and I have been doing some post-Christmas reflecting.  Here is where I come for refreshment and renewal after a hectic Christmas season. Here is where I make every effort to renew my spirit and refill my cup so that I can give my best to the people whom I serve in my parish and beyond.

Part of my retreat is to examine what it is that I have done to make myself as tired and depleted as I have felt. My spiritual director is good at pulling from me the “other” stuff that wears me out and how to establish good ways to serve God and the parish so that doesn’t continue to happen.

We have been looking at all of this with the help of a book written by Joan Chittester called “The Monastery of the Heart.”

In her book Chittester says, “Retreat time is the practice of making personal time for the kind of spiritual time that is beyond the routine of religious practices or spiritual duties.” In other words, what we need to do is take time away from our everyday activities and pay attention to God and how God is at work in our lives – even if for only a few minutes in our day.

When we make time for God in our daily lives – and I mean intentional time, then we will find ourselves refilling our cups, renewing our spiritual selves and we will be refreshed.

As you find your way through 2012, take time for God every day. Learn what it is that makes you renewed and refreshed. Move through the coming days with joy and peace with God by your side.

See you tomorrow when I get home. Do you think that you can manage a 20 degree day for me?


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Water skier Karen Stevens has big end to season at Pan Am games

January 11, 2012 Editor


Local water skier, Karen Stevens, finished off a hugely successful chapter in her water skiing accomplishments this past fall, when she represented Canada at the 2011 Pan Am games in Mexico, in October. At the games, Stevens scored three bronze medals for Canada, one each in the slalom and jump events and the third in a separate ‘overall’ three event competition (slalom, tricks and jumps).

Stevens, 22, described as “another in an endless stream of young rising stars in the sport in Canada” in an October 23 WaterSki & Wakeboard Canada story, finished an impressive third in the ‘overall’ at the Pan Am games behind gold medal winner Regina Jacques of the U.S. and Canadian teammate and silver medal winner Whitney McClintock of Cambridge, Ontario.

In the WaterSki & Wakeboard Canada article, Stevens was quoted saying, “The competition was tough. It’s awesome to come home with three medals. I’m very happy with the way it has gone.”

The Leader caught up with Stevens in December, when she was home for a visit.

Of her selection for the four-member Canadian team, the highest team selection of her skiing career to date, she said, “It was an honour to be picked for the Canadian team. It was pretty cool. We are a really young team (21 to 27 years). The coolest thing for me was that my medals contributed to Canada’s medal count.”

Making the trip to Mexico, for the Pan American games was Karen’s dad, Mark, who says, “It was really good. There were more people there than I have ever seen at a water ski competition. It was a very big week.”

“When they picked the Canadian team they were looking for a skier who they felt could get them three bronze medals,” he explained. “So she did what they wanted. It was truly an honour for her to be picked, and we were happy with her performance. She jumped her personal best and her tricks were close to her personal best. Unfortunately, her best event, slalom was down a bit.”

Mark, also an accomplished skier, says he is extremely proud of Karen, but admits, “It’s hard watching. It is definitely worse than skiing yourself.”

Karen concludes that it was an absolute thrill to compete at the Pan Am games and to be in Guadalajara, Mexico, where she says the athletes were treated ‘royally’.

Over 5,000 athletes representing 42 countries in over 30 sports competed at the Pan American Games which are a continental Americas’ version of the Olympic Games. Held every four years, they include the Olympic Program sports and others that are not part of the Olympic Games.

Canada is scheduled to host the next edition of the Games in 2015, in Toronto.

For the last four years, Karen has skied for the University of Louisiana Monroe (ULM) ski team. This team is the most successful water ski team in the history of collegiate water skiing having won 20 plus national championships since 1979.

She has now completed the four-year Kinesiology Program at ULM. This winter she is completing the required internship for her ULM degree at the National Training Institute in Florida. She is now skiing competitively, focusing on the slalom pro tour events.

Karen has been water skiing pretty much since she could walk. She got her early training from her dad and grew up skiing with her younger siblings, brother Daniel and sister Janice, in the home bay east of Iroquois.

Karen was a strong skier for the ULM team and her rankings over the four years by the National Collegiate Water Skiing Association, an affiliate of the USA Water Ski Association, are quite impressive.

She completed her final ski season at the college level in 2010, finishing first in Slalom and fourth overall at the Division 1, U.S. Collegiate Nationals.

Final 2011 International Water Ski Association elite women’s slalom rankings have Karen ranked ninth in the world.


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Chris McDonough reflects on year of change

January 11, 2012 Editor


On January 10th, 2011, Chris McDonough became the first full-time fire chief for South Dundas.

Almost a year later, on January 4th, 2012, he talked with The Leader about the many changes that have taken place, including the amalgamation of three fire departments into one.

The Morrisburg, Iroquois, and Williamsburg stations came together to form what is now known as the South Dundas Fire and Emergency Services (SDFES), a name chosen by McDonough to reflect the variety of services provided.

Such services include, but are not limited to: public education, inspections, suppression capabilities, water rescue, and auto extrications. As McDonough, attested, “it’s been a busy, but very positive year. I’ve really enjoyed the challenge.”

He went on to explain that, in addition to regular fire suppression services, “as the community grows, more services are required.” He pointed out, for example, that SDFES is also responsible for the area’s auto extrication calls as well as calls associated with incidents on the St. Lawrence River. 

McDonough attributes many of the changes to population growth. In the summer, with tourism and the addition of “more people coming to visit the community,” the SDFES is much busier. In fact, “call volume was up last year.”

According to McDonough, Christmas time and the winter months “people tend to get complacent in regards to fire and life safety.” Here he referred to the predominance of accidental fires due to improper use of candles, heating, decorations, and, in addition, to the lack of carbon monoxide (CO) detectors in homes.

McDonough reminded that South Dundas council recently passed a by-law making carbon monoxide detectors in homes mandatory that have fuel fired appliances or attached garages. He believes that South Dundas  is the “first in the county to get that by-law in place.”

He would point out to residents that the by-law “is for their own safety.” In fact, McDonough reported that last week Ottawa Fire responded to an incident where a family was transported to hospital with severe CO symptoms due to a defective furnace.

The South Dundas firefighters have been promoting the carbon monoxide alarm program along with the smoke alarm program to great effect. So far, as promised earlier in the fall, they have been able to visit 50 homes in the township to check and install smoke alarms. The program, McDonough says, “has been well received in the community and has been very successful.”

As for the firefighters themselves, according to McDonough, the deputy-chiefs and firefighters from all the stations “really work well together. There’s no longer three separate fire stations.”

“We’re working together and moving forward in a really positive way.”

Representatives from each of the three stations have formed a training committee and a fire prevention committee, which meet monthly. Everyone is dedicated to ensuring that all members are “in line” with the section 21 training guidelines.

In fact, McDonough revealed that, going forward, the firefighters will be using the new training facility in Lyndhurst, Ontario.

In addition to the aforementioned monthly meeting, Chief McDonough also meets monthly with the three deputy and assistant deputy-chiefs from each station. As he explained, the stations are now working as one, which means assessing needs and helping each other out when necessary. 

“We rely on each other,” he said. “We’re all coordinating together now. The officers and firefighters are working really well together. It’s been quite a transition.”

Another positive change for the South Dundas Fire and Emergency Services can be found in its administration. Reports, training records, and inventory from all three stations have been brought together to form one main archive. In addition to providing easier access to information, the new system also allows the chief to ensure that the SDFES records are complete and properly filed. 

“This has also been a cost savings to the residents; having everything centralized we can evaluate our resources and avoid duplication,” said McDonough.

As for fire team members, McDonough was quick to commend and applaud the generosity and professionalism of everyone. In terms of the number of volunteer hours many of the firefighters put in, he said, “it’s just been amazing… incredible. I’ve been very pleased with that.”

Firefighters meet three to four times a month for continual training, keeping everyone ready and prepared for whatever might arise. The chief tries to attend some of these meetings as well.

In addition to the volunteer hours they put in for training and for actual emergency response, the firefighters also make time for fun events with the public.

“We’re trying to get involved in community events and public functions,” because, as McDonough pointed out, “it’s all community services.”  

The three stations have also come together to work on renovations and to ensure that each station has what they need. The Morrisburg station is expecting the delivery of a new heavy rescue truck by the end of this month. And, in 2012, the Iroquois station may just find itself with a new pumper rescue truck.

“I’ve had a lot of positive feedback from the guys. They are happy with the changes,” McDonough confirmed.

With that said, due to some retirements, the South Dundas Fire and Emergency Services is looking for some new recruits for the Williamsburg and the Morrisburg stations. Those interested can go to for more information. Without a computer? Call the township office for additional information at 613-535-2673.


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Everyday is a new day with no mistakes in it

January 4, 2012 Editor


“Every day is a new day,” wrote Lucy Maud Montgomery in  Anne of Green Gables. Well, with this edition, it’s a new month and a new year. Have you made any New Year’s resolutions? Have you sat down and taken stock of what you did last year and then planned for what you want to achieve this year?

Well, according to genius Albert Einstein, “if you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.” In other words, money won’t buy you happiness. Goals that revolve around “getting” someone or something are rarely satisfying and, most often, a waste of valuable time. In contrast, the best goals to set are those that will make a positive difference in your life or in the lives of those around you. 

I do this every year. Sometimes I succeed and sometimes I don’t. Some things get checked off my list and some things don’t. Either way, I still like to feel like I have a purpose or direction to follow during the coming days – (as opposed to flailing around aimlessly until that fateful hour when my heart stops ticking).

In goal setting, it’s important to remember some famous advice: Winston Churchill once said, “success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.” So, if at first you don’t succeed, then try again… and again… and again… and again… (Get the idea?)

Another piece of advice that I found helpful when “taking stock” is from Kofi Annan: “To live is to choose. But to choose well, you must know who you are and what you stand for, where you want to go and why you want to get there.”

Life doesn’t happen by mistake. Life happens because of choices we make or choices others make. Things, for the most part, don’t happen “to” us. We make choices every moment of every day, whether we acknowledge that fact, or not. 

Something I tell myself and something I tell my children often: “just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.” Think first. Ask yourself, who do I want to be? How will this choice affect me and the people around me? Choose wisely and remember, if you get it wrong, tomorrow is a “new day with no mistakes in it”, so try again.    


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Perspectives by Rev. Janet Evans

January 4, 2012 Editor


New Path for 2012

“I said to the man who stood at the gate of the year-give me a light that I might tread safely into the unknown, but he said put your hand into the hand of God. That shall be to you better than light and safer than a known way.”

These words have been used by me several times before in this column, and I always find them inspiring.

As we walk into 2012, may we indeed place our hand into God’s hand–our Lord will comfort, sustain and guide us as we travel along life’s journey.

What will 2012 bring? We do not know.

Have we made any New Year’s resolutions–perhaps we have done this! 

We would do well to offer compassion to someone who is hurting, who has asked us for help.

Perhaps we could resolve to feed the hungry, uplift the ill, visit the lonely.

We can forgive those who have shattered our lives and maybe another individual will forgive us when we have said we are sorry for making a mistake.

In the coming year, may we draw closer to God and to one another. May we remember that “the old things are passed away. Behold! I make all things new.” (Revelation 21:5).

We can in 2012, become new beings, set on a new path. God teaches us to believe that the life before us in the new year is part of His plan and will unfold for us as it should if we are prepared to accept His guidance.

Rev. Janet Evans, 

Iroquois United Church



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Novice B Lions win Winchester tournament

January 4, 2012 Editor


The South Dundas “Pizza Hut” Novice B Lions continued their tournament success by winning the “A” Championship at the North Dundas Demons Novice B Tournament last Tuesday. In the championship game the Lions defeated the tournament host team Demons, 6-2 while in preliminary action the Lions defeated Smith Falls 3-2 and South Stormont 3-0.

With the tournament title on the line, the Lions faced their county partners the North Dundas Demons. 

The Demons came out early and put the pressure on the Lions and were able to grab a 1-0 lead one minute in. 

With the Lions on their heels, goalie Brendan Shaver had to come up big to keep the lead to one. 

The Lions got going late in the first and Nolan Henry tied the game, 1-1, with only 13 seconds left. 

Ben Lapier started the play at his own blue line and made an excellent pass to Henry who stick handled into the offensive zone and beat the Demons goaltender.

In the second period, the Lions had the momentum to take the lead they would not relinquish. 

Joshua Broad set up Kayne McCadden as he went top shelf for the 2-1 lead, and moments later Lapier struck from the slot on a pass from Owen Fetterly for a 3-1 Lions lead. 

Sitting out the game was defenseman Emytt Fetterly, so Spencer Barclay, Cassidy Bilmer and Trent Rae had to pick up the extra ice time.

In the third, the Lions iced the game with another three counters. 

Trent Rae started a play in his own end, getting the puck to Joshua Broad who made a breakout pass to Kayne McCadden which sent him on a breakaway where he would score again.

Off the centre ice draw, McCadden got the puck and broke in on the Demons goalie beating him for the third time, a “hat trick” goal. 

Lapier rounded out the Lions scoring before the Demons netted one late for the 6-2 final. 

Kayne McCadden was selected for the game MVP award and the Lions were crowned tournament champions.

In their second game against the South Stormont Selects, the Lions grabbed an early lead and then left the rest up to goalie Brendan Shaver who was extremely strong in the Lions cage making several point blank saves. 

With the score 2-0 on two goals by Ben Lapier, Selects Owen Carter stick handled to the slot and ripped a shot glove slide that Shaver snagged. 

The Selects continued to pressure Shaver who made three saves on a scramble in the blue paint. 

The Selects out shot the Lions, but Shaver made all the saves for his second shutout of the season. 

Kayne McCadden scored a power-play goal in the third to round out the scoring. 

Assists went to Lapier, Owen Fetterly and Nolan Henry.

Brendan Shaver earned his forth tournament game MVP award in only his eighth try this season. 

In the tournament opening game, the Lions faced off against the Smith Falls Bears and once again fell behind 1-0 in the first period before Joshua Broad dug the puck out of the corner after it hit the referee’s skates and centered a pass to Ben Lapier who scored with a shot on the ice. 

The Bears grabbed a 2-1 lead, before Joshua Broad and Kayne McCadden hooked up on the same line with Kolby Latulippe to score on back to back shifts. 

McCadden grabbed as loose puck in the corner after a Spencer Barclay rush and centred it to the slot where Broad was standing all alone. 

Broad held the puck until the goalie went down and then shot it over him into the open net. 

Moments later Broad would grabbed a loose puck in his own end and banked a pass off the boards to McCadden who went end to end to score the game winner.

Joshua Broad received the game MVP award.

In three tournaments this season, the Lions have earned the “A” Championship in North Dundas, the “B” Championship in Gananoque and they were the “A” Finalist in Finch, losing the “A” Final in overtime.


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Year-end money matters

January 4, 2012 Editor


“We do appreciate staff’s due diligence in working with numbers,” said Mayor Steven Byvelds at the December 20th South Dundas council meeting.

He was referring to the three end-of-year reports from the township’s Treasurer, Shannon Geraghty: Year End Surplus/Deficits; Tax Write Offs for 2011 Taxation Year; and, Budget Amendments for 2011.

The second report requested the write-off of $88,446.89 for the 2011 taxation year. According to Geraghty, the number breaks down into $624.55 in residential write-offs and $87,822.34 in commercial write-offs.

He also reported that: “an amount of $75,000 was set by council in the approval of the final 2011 budget and therefore we are over budget by an amount of $13,447, which will be financed through the operations budget.”

The third report asked for council’s approval on $26,950.55 worth of amendments made to the 2011 budget during the year. 

The amendments consisted of the following previously approved expenditures: $2,000 to the Morrisburg Lions Club; $1,000 to the Iroquois Plaza Celebration; $6,086.70 to fix the Roof Top of the Iroquois Civic Centre; and, $17,863.85 to fix the Roof Top/Heat Exchanger for the Justice Building in Morrisburg.


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Heritage signs for South Dundas

January 4, 2012 Editor


“The services of the militia of Dundas County and sister counties deserve an honoured place in history, and in no better way can we cherish the memory of  those fellows than by paying tribute to the spot on which they fought and bled for their country,” wrote J. Smyth Carter in 1905.

Bill Shearing referenced this quote during his proposal to South Dundas council on December 20th where he recommended that council erect four signs along County Road 2 recognizing specific historical events connected to the War of 1812. 

“Our township has much forgotten history,” he said, “especially with the War of 1812.”

While council agreed with Shearing’s reasoning and historical documentation, they decided that Shearing needed to do more research into possible funding for the  signs as well as options for sign construction and design.

Councillor Evonne Delegarde was very supportive. “I think that would be nice to have,” she said, reminding council that “it’s going to be a great year for tourism.”


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South Dundas council takes stock: looking back over 2011 and looking forward to 2012

January 4, 2012 Editor


“We won’t change South Dundas overnight, but we do need to grow. How we grow is something that we will all have to work on,” said Steven Byvelds during his first year end review as Mayor of South Dundas, just 12 months ago. 

On December 16th, Byvelds had the opportunity to discuss and report on just how much South Dundas has changed in the past year, good or bad, and what council’s plans include for 2012.

Old High School

The refurbishment of the old high school, according to Byvelds, was and continues to be the big news item for this particular South Dundas council. He reported that, for the most part, he is hearing good comments from the public. 

Byvelds revealed that council is looking forward to the completion of the project, saying, “it holds great promise and hopefully we don’t hit too many roadblocks.”

He reiterated council’s stance on the reasoning behind the project, saying, “this building (in Williamsburg) was in theory a temporary building.” In any case, he also pointed out that council’s needs have “outgrown” the present building.

In terms of how this move will affect Williamsburg, Byvelds admitted that “from a municipal point of view, it will be good. From a Williamsburg point of view, it’s another thing leaving.”

He suggested that council will “work with them (residents) to see what we can bring here” to Williamsburg.

Byvelds admitted that, most often, South Dundas residents remark on the seeming favoritism toward Morrisburg and Iroquois. 

He reminded reporters that “council is always concerned that we have to think of all of South Dundas.” However, “we aren’t really growing as a community. Morrisburg and Iroquois are growing.”

Budget Talk

In terms of tightening the belts in 2012, Byvelds said, “it will be a little tighter of a year. Economically when things change in the world, we have to recognize that as a council, and work within those parameters.”

“Going forward, we’re certainly going to have to look at our budget. We don’t have the growth or the high income jobs.”

“I don’t see us overspending, but we have to do what we have to do to not get behind.”

For example, “we want to do something in Industrial Park (in Morrisburg). We think that is a good investment. We need to invest to get that going.”

He finished the discussion on budget concerns, reminding reporters of two things: “we’re in a very healthy fiscal position,” and, “growth has to pay for itself.”

Iroquois Golf Course

“It’s one less thing that we as council have to worry about,” said Byvelds, referring to the Iroquois Golf Course and the lengthy controversy that surrounded it.

“I think we were as open as we could be concerning that.” Referencing public meetings devoted to the issue, he continued, “we gave people an opportunity to voice their concerns.”

“They have a two-year lease there. They have the possibility of looking at development. It’s their business. They’ve paid their bills.”

“From a municipal point of view, we were looking at another 50 grand easy and we weren’t prepared to do that.”


In discussing some of the improvements made during 2011, Byvelds talked about the boil water advisory protocol that was initiated. He referred to the drinking water and wastewater systems being upgraded and he talked of the study being done on the storm drain systems.

“Hopefully it will not only be better for the community, but it will hopefully drive more people into the community.”

Jim McDonell

Byvelds was asked to comment on how he thought the election of PC Jim McDonell would affect South Dundas considering that the province is run by a Liberal Premier.

Byvelds responded, saying, McDonell “will have his work cut out for him. It was easier for Jim Brownell. 99 per cent of rural MPs are progressive conservative. It will have its challenges. The money is not going to flow as easily. He has a tougher row to hoe.”

Byvelds reminded reporters that he would be attending the Rural Ontario Municipal Association conference in February and, he noted, “the Premier will be there that day.”

Working as Warden

Byvelds assured reporters that he did not let his decisions as Warden for the United Counties interfere with his responsibilities as Mayor for South Dundas and, vice versa.

“When I’m for South Dundas, I’m thinking about what is best for South Dundas,” he said.

Byvelds pointed out that “lots of systems within our society are trust. You’ve got to have some trust in society.”

New Fire Chief

In January 2011, a new fire chief was hired, uniting the three South Dundas fire stations of Morrisburg, Iroquois, and Williamsburg. Byvelds stated: “Fire Chief McDonough has really done a good job. He’s getting our three stations working on the same page. Chris has brought a lot of expertise in fire prevention and how things should be done on scenes.”

“It’s been fully demonstrated that when we have to work with other municipalities that we have one point person. As council, we needed that,” he explained.

In assessing the new South Dundas Fire and Emergency Services, Byvelds said, “I think we’re starting to sinc up. It was an investment we had to do. It was just the right move to do. We did our research.”

He maintained that the decision was based on safety, not politics.

Byvelds pointed out that “after a year, we haven’t heard any significant negatives.”

Council’s Objectives

Byvelds maintained that council’s objectives have been and continue to be “reinvestment, to not raise taxes, and to keep community involved.”

He advised patience, saying, “You can’t expect those 10 issues to be dealt with in one day.” He wasn’t referring to any issues in particular, just the speed at which issues get resolved.

Byvelds believes that “overall, council has worked well together.”

He admitted, “we don’t always agree,” but, he continued, he would be concerned if they did always agree.

Attendance at Meetings

When asked how he felt about the low turnout of residents at the regular council meetings, Byvelds pointed out, “they’re always concerned for the most part, but if they feel things are going well” then they don’t feel the need to show up.

Strategic Plan

Byvelds told reporters that “the strategic plan will be rolled out in the new year. Council is hoping that the community does get involved.”

He hopes the plan is “steered more by the community rather than by the council.”

“Give us an idea of where you want to go with South Dundas,” he invited.

He pointed out that this plan is meant to cover all of South Dundas, including the smaller rural communities. He also said that council wants to hear from “everybody, not just the special interest groups.”

According to Byvelds, council is interested in learning about the attitudes of South Dundas residents and what it is “they want to grow in South Dundas.”

He would remind everyone: “It’s not council’s plan; it’s your plan.”

In Summation

There were “a lot of good things” in 2011. As Byvelds pointed out, the Iroquois Golf Course situation was resolved, council successfully completed their first budget, and council reinvested in the community.

Looking ahead to 2012, Byvelds admits that the “budget is going to be a challenge.” He and council want to “reinvest in the community without bankrupting the community.”

He maintains that it is important to “always have a vision.” And, in addition, he wants council to continue being open  to new ideas from staff, as well as from the community.